Do Systems over a long enough timeline centralize power? How can leadership keep the system flexible and responsive?

What do you think? Discuss in the comments below!

Stuart Scheller

Comments

    1. Workaround for v3 reCaptcha is for an admin to make the first post. Which you just did. 🙂

    2. A couple of us have been building extensive databases and using those databases to build action platforms for Americans. I have a PhD in AI and 60 years experience in the field. I have been a politician of sorts, having served on a schoolboard. I have taught ethics. At IBM I was in a department called “Methods”, which was tasked with finding immature business processes and, through pursuasion, modeling, financial analysis, etc. maturing those organizations and business processes. So, the discipline of “Methods,” which has a NIST standard, answers the posed question. My friend has worked in the virology field for 20 years and has been working on how to achieve integrity in voting systems from the grass roots. We are both “retired,” though we work all day establishing positions with justification and citations.
      We want to join the team.

  1. All systems, public or private, will bend toward corruption over time. The key is allowing mechanisms of failure. The market, unhampered, accomplishes this through competition. A government will not allow for competitive vectors of authority and thus, can only corrupt and collapse across a long enough timeline.

    IF, an answer exists, it rests within a model of individual, voluntary choice. A government provides a service. That service has a market with demand. Where demand exists coercion is not required. A model of competing governments, centered on voluntary choice of association is possible and not even without precedent believe it or not.

    IMHO

    https://libertarianinstitute.org/blog/the-paradox-of-authority/

  2. Answer to the first question is, generally, yes. Although since the Industrial Age, we’re dealing with systems of systems. So it’s even more complex. For instance, a quad-copter drone is comprised of multiple systems and digital circuits, with many more systems (design, O&M, etc.) that support its cradle to grave lifespan.

    Man is naturally tribal in nature and the “modern” extension of that system was a confederation; a republic of few and limited commonwealths/states. The more complex an artificial system gets – and it invariably does, without exception – the more BTUs (both literally and figuratively) it needs to sustain itself and to stave off entropy. All systems are the same; it is what it is. This was the quintessential secret of Temujin’s success that not one military college save perhaps the Chinese understands.

    Think about the military today. It is primarily responsible for eating out the sustenance of the nation, from Gen X through future unborn generations. Off-budget is even more immoral and disgraceful. How many BTUs does it consume annually, barrels of oil or otherwise? As Ike intimated, for every soldier that’s fed, how many citizens pay for him in current and future earnings? Is it sustainable in any way, shape, or form? Is it moral?

    Answer to the second question is best summed up by what LTG Mixon taught me years and years ago. Make decisions with the best intel you have available, and be ready to do so quickly. If it was the wrong decision, add the data to the Lessons Learned slide – and don’t make the same mistake again. There will be PLENTY of opportunity to make new mistakes! 🙂

    America needs to reset itself in every way. It needs a do-over. Perhaps 1% is ready, both spiritually and emotionally, for what that entails. (And yes, this is primarily a spiritual war.) Nevertheless, it can’t be held off forever. The amount of pain that that will necessitate is terrible to think about. But worship of materialism and all of the complexity that it entails is hardly a normal state of affairs, and like it or not, the average American supported it by action (or inaction).

    In fact, I’d say that those who do support the Old Normal are normal only in their abnormalities.

    tl;dr America suffers from an addiction to a complex system of systems built on materialism. It’s unsustainable in two ways: 1) Without investment in, say, thorium and/or fusion, etc., we don’t have the BTUs; and 2) Every manmade system of government where its populace replaced God with idolatry/materialism ended up on the imperial dumpster fire.

  3. I think our current system of government gained power because we as a people allowed them to. The forefathers did not create checks and balances for government to grow.

    After WWII we started living a life of true prosperity in this country. This created a lackluster attitude towards who we select as leadership for a long period of time. While the American people were asleep government slowly grew into a giant cesspool of corruption.

    I remember growing up in the 90’s when Election Day would roll around people would say that they either didn’t vote at all or they’ll get to it if they can. I think it was hard to get a gauge on where people truly stood on certain issues because of this attitude.

    As one example. Once Obamacare rolled out in 2010 it was clear that most people where not paying close attention to what goes on within DC. In my opinion Obamacare was created to fail in order to funnel people onto government medical care. These types of moves create huge power grabs by the federal government.

    In 2016 people began to see how these types of policies were effecting them. In Arizona for instance there were people paying $15,000-20,000 deductibles for garbage healthcare because there was only one healthcare insurance provider in the state.

    States particularly in the north east didn’t mind this as much because there was more to choose from therefore lower cost incurred. This was a major divide.

    I think true leadership could in fact keep things from happening like this. However, when you have 80 years of relative peace it is difficult to keep people engaged in keeping good leadership in office. If issues aren’t effecting people I.e 9/12/2001 when people went back to normal life after airplanes slammed into sides of buildings, instead of 12/8/1941 where EVERYONE was affected by the impending war, then individuals will be less likely to be engaged.

    In the system of government that our forefathers created it is ABSOLUTELY possible for leadership to keep our government flexible and responsive, but we would have to keep the individuals engaged enough not to select self absorbed trash to lead us.

    1. Michael,

      I do believe that you and I have viewed the world through the same lens. It’s refreshing to read your posts.

      The only paragraph I disagree with is the last. The Agile lifecycle taught me over the years that there appears to be a “sweet spot” in the size and scope of a team. Kinda like trying to find that sweet spot that forces your auto tranny into overdrive. In software development, we found the optimal team size was 6-7 with a mix of experience and skill sets. It was small enough to adjust, and large enough to keep the damn MBAs in their places when they had unrealistic expectations.

      The same logic can be applied to a government.

      The problem that I’ve encountered, though, is that the people who actually produce anything (developers, robotics designers, engineers, farmers, septic tank builders, electricians, etc.) always and everywhere become “ruled” by the “finger-pointing” unproductive class. I believe it initially starts as a “do-gooder” who sees how successful they are and thinks to himself: “Hrm, I can make it better!” And therein begins the downfall. Perfect being the enemy of good enough and all that.

      It’s a fatal character flaw in humans.

      Once enough producers tell Washington to go jump up their asses and grab ham sammiches, it’s over. And that’s what I’m working on, a bottom up strike. Imagine what would happen if every plumber refused to service a federal government employee’s toilet? Let the shit flow, bro!

      Or if truckers refused to deliver food to the cities? Or if the farmers refused to GROW the food? It’d be total panic within 72 hours.

      It would be epic. Give it time, it’s gonna happen. Washington did it to themselves. They own it. THAT is how you win a peaceful revolution. Let ’em spit on you, hose you down, and denigrate you. In the end, Dr. King and Gandhi WON.

  4. Dale GilbreathDecember 31, 2021

    An extremely complex issue and I won’t pretend to have all the answers but I do have a few thoughts.

    I’ll preface them by saying I have no expectation that the Establishment will support any of them without significant pressure.

    1) We need to consciously move power away from the federal government back to the states, counties etc. I personally believe that was the original intent of the framers of the Constitution. Politicians far removed from even the geography of their constituents quickly lose touch with the real needs of those they represent.

    How we convince not only the politicians in Washington but also the American people who’ve become dependent on the bloated bureaucracy I do not know.

    2) As citizens, we need to do our part. Like it or not, we got to this point in part because we did not stay engaged and hold leaders accountable for failed policies and federal overreach.

    3) Possibly consider a dual responsibility in which our state Congressmembers have a direct impact on the votes of our Congressional delegates in Washington. Possibly even allow for a recall of federal Congressional delegates by state representatives. I can’t imagine we’d want it to be easy but we might want to allow for the possibility, perhaps requiring a supermajority, or even a special plebiscite.

    4) Limit the impact of special interest groups in Washington and identify a way to force those efforts back to the state and local levels.

    Just some initial thoughts.

    1. I’ve thought about the argument concerning strengthening local governments. I’m not sure I agree. While I agree the Federal government has gotten way too big and out of control. But our current United States is much different than what the founding fathers dealt with. We are more connected with information, transportation, and commerce than ever before. Having different rules each time we crossed state lines would be confusing. So I think the answer is to limit the Federal Government’s power, but not to make separate governments in each state that are drastically different.

    2. Dale GilbreathDecember 31, 2021

      I see your point. My fear is simply creating another iteration of our current problem. It’s why, for example, I’m leery of a Convention of States.

      We’re going to have to think outside the box a little, I expect. I don’t need to lead but I will not follow blindly.

      Thank you for creating this forum. With all the censorship and intolerance I’ve withdrawn in many ways to an echo forum even though I know it’s not helpful. I’m eager to see a free exchange of ideas. If that can be duplicated someday on the national stage, we may see better days.

      Semper fi, sir.

  5. I think centralizing power is always the natural tendency in a republic. Decentralized power means more people need to be capable of governing, on a political level but also just managing their own lives. That takes hard work and discipline, so entropy works against it – I think mostly in the form of people just being too lazy, fearful, comfortable, etc. to bother with self-government, instead letting others do the job for them.

    This was a huge concern for the Founders – how the regime depends on the virtue of the people, and without “sufficient virtue among men for self-government,” only “the chains of despotism can restrain them from destroying and devouring one another” (Federalist 55). I think most of our problems now are because we’ve forgotten what it means to govern ourselves, and we’re happy to let other people rule us as long as they keep us safe and comfortable.

    If this is right, in a way it’s s good news, because it means there’s a fix, but it’s also pretty daunting because the fix, the only way back from tyranny, is instilling enough virtue into the American people for self-government again. Not sure how you do that, but I think that’s where the conversation needs to happen.

    1. Great points. “I think most of our problems now are because we’ve forgotten what it means to govern ourselves.” So well said.

    2. Dale GilbreathDecember 31, 2021

      Absolutely loved your post. Great reminder that the Founding Fathers were aware of the risks that might lead to our current situation. I have nothing but admiration for what they did and personally believe they were inspired by God. Just my opinion.

      They were avid students of history and learned its lessons well. Our society has fallen far and, in my opinion, our current government’s corruption is in some ways a natural extension of the moral decay in our society.

  6. @Stuart:

    “I’ve thought about the argument concerning strengthening local governments. I’m not sure I agree. While I agree the Federal government has gotten way too big and out of control. But our current United States is much different than what the founding fathers dealt with. We are more connected with information, transportation, and commerce than ever before. Having different rules each time we crossed state lines would be confusing. So I think the answer is to limit the Federal Government’s power, but not to make separate governments in each state that are drastically different.”

    Times change, technologies change. But the passions of Man never do. In 100 years we’ll have probably reached level 1 on the Kardashev scale, assuming we haven’t destroyed ourselves (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kardashev_scale). And we’ll still be fucking up how we communicate with each other and govern ourselves. To wit, Machiavelli from Discourses on Livy:

    “Anyone who studies present and ancient affairs will easily see how in all cities and all peoples there still exist, and have always existed, the same desires and passions. Thus, it is an easy matter for him who carefully examines past events to foresee future events in a republic and to apply the remedies employed by the ancients, or, if old remedies cannot be found, to devise new ones based upon the similarity of the events. But since these matters are neglected or not understood by those who read, or, if understood, remain unknown to those who govern, the result is that the same problems always exist in every era.”

    History is a catalog of solutions wherein it may never perfectly repeat, but it does indeed rhyme. I can’t say what, exactly, the perfect solution is RE: strengthening of local governments. But what I CAN say is that we were closer to the “sweet spot” somewhere between the Articles of Confederation and the Constitution.

    To be frank, I have more in common with the average Swiss than I do with the average New Yorker or Californian. They have a government which more closely represents a democratic confederation than we do; they’re predominantly Christian; they’re well-armed; and many of them speak fluent English and French. I have nothing in common with the coasts for the most part and would just as soon they go their own separate ways, or for us to do so.

    I really don’t get why this country so liberally accepts marital divorce like it’s nothing significant, but God forbid we discuss a national divorce. Which of those divorces more dramatically impacts our kids anyways? Good grief, I just don’t get why Americans are one of the few societies which can’t peaceably dissolve so as to avoid bloodshed. That’s where we’re heading, and it’s terrible.

    1. I think you are obviously well read and have thought about this a great deal. I appreciate the insight. I also agree the swiss do a lot of good things. The way they protect information from being collected on their citizens is a great example. But to your last point, I don’t think we are headed to a National divorce. I understand it’s worth discussing, but I prefer Lincoln’s philosophy of Unity. I think we still have time to bring people together.

    2. To your suggestion that producers stop producing, truckers stop trucking and plumbers stop plumbing…may I respectfully suggest that all you will accomplish is to give government the license to nationalize any and all elements of our infrastructure as they deem necessary to keep the food (and crap) flowing. And the recalcitrant producers, truckers and plumbers will suffer the opprobrium of those being fed by their “saviors” in the government. You can’t hurt the government without hurting the people, and the people are too comfortable to want to play Gandhi.

  7. Check out Dr. V.A. Shiva Ayyadurai for more on ‘systems’.

    Our Federal government seems to be such a huge and complex system that no one person can change it in a meaningful way. It controls itself.

    Being elected to Congress is such a life-changing event now (money, power, perks) that holding the office is the most important thing to these people. Enriching themselves is all-consuming. Not doing what is right.

    Politics has turned off a large majority of the population and they tune it out. They are busy working and enjoying their lives so they check out and leave it to someone else.

    How many people do you know that even want to talk about politics?

    Reagan once said that the problem with politics is that good people don’t want anything to do with it. Sad, because politics is what decides everything in life.

    And yes, I agree with the comment that we simply let all this happen.

  8. Yes. Servant leadership! In too many organizations to include the military it seems careerism is taught over serve the mission and the people you lead to the best of your ability while learning from those you serve with and if you get promoted great, if not you still can hold your head high knowing you served with honor. In other words let the chips fall where they may with respect to promotions. Too many “leaders” calculate their decisions based on how it will affect their careers not how it will affect the mission or affect those whom they lead! I saw this first hand for 23 years as both an enlisted and commissioned in the Air Force. I still love the Air Force, despite my many criticisms and if I didn’t consider the Air Force as my family I wouldn’t care! I just know we could do much better! For instance, take a look at the suicide rate among current military, not to mention veterans! As of Sept 2021 it is 4 times the number of combat deaths since 9/11. What is the AF answer? More training classes and placing a therapist in every squadron. I admit the awareness training was good at helping me as a person and a leader identify signs, however to me it comes down to the first line leaders to get to know their troops and I mean know them and care for them not just as a number! To get out from behind the desk and walk the line, have more than a surface convo with them about the weather and get to know their personalities, their goals, their background, who their families are etc. Help them and encourage them to meet those goals even if it’s not in the military. Knowing that their leaders genuinely give a shit about them goes a long way in mission accomplishment as well. They will be more willing to do the hard or “meaningless” things you ask of them. Over time your team or unit will become like a family. Sure you will still have problems but they will be much more easy to cope with with your family looking out for you especially when it’s demonstrated by leaders. A sense of belonging will follow! But the AF weighs leaders down with email taskers, PowerPoint meetings and paperwork drills! This demanding time suck not only disables ability to get out and walk the line but also drains leaders. When I was a new LT, I remember asking my O-6 what did you do as an LT before email, PowerPoint etc…he said I was on the line with the troops. I told him then that’s where I’ll be, I won’t be at my desk much Sir. And all the way up until I retired as a Captain (reached my goal BTW) that’s where I was mostly! There were times he would see me and say Chris did you get my email, and I would respond No Sir, I haven’t been in my office. He would always chuckle and then tell me what the email was in about 3 seconds. Imagine that face to face communication at work! In Colin Powell’s book “It Worked for Me: In Life and Leadership” he told the story of always getting talked to for not being behind his desk enough. He was often out with his troops. A must read BTW. I could go on but this is hopefully a good start to the convo.

    1. Dale GilbreathJanuary 1, 2022

      Your message really resonated with me. In my case, the Marine Corps but definitely the same concerns. Excellent points.

  9. Linardakis L.January 1, 2022

    The tendency towards centralization is in my opinion inevitable and the consequence of a feedback loop between culture and centralization itself. Centralization shifts the culture over time, and time normalizes the new culture, which then allows for greater centralization than was previously acceptable to the society, and so on.

    The first part of this loop, centralization, is eventually necessary on some level. The more complex a problem becomes; the more centralized society must become to take decisive action and respond effectively. An example being if the entirety of the American war effort in WW2 had to be coordinated and administered at the level of local militias or state guards only. With time, more problems arise (real or perceived) that necessitate some further form of centralization to address. As these centralizations become the norm, the individual is further and further removed from the ultimate responsibility for their own lives; the level of individual responsibility needed to simply stay alive as say an 1850s settler out West is vastly greater than that of a modern day American. Ultimately this shapes the society’s culture at the top and the bottom. The bottom over time begins to lose any semblance of ultimate responsibility for their lives, as the path of least resistance is to simply delegate problems up the chain (e.g., “why pick up my trash, the city will get it eventually”, “why worry about my health, healthcare is free”). Meanwhile every step up the ladder is imbued with more power, attracting more corruption and creating a detachment from the governed, who are ever further removed from any real power; giving those above them a sense of impunity if not outright superiority. This creates rigid structures, societal atrophy, and ultimately an inability to adapt/overcome new problems or even manage existing ones.

    The cultural aspect of this loop always lags the centralization by a bit. As the older generations die off, so too does the direct knowledge of a time before a given level of centralization was viewed as necessary. To have a functioning system of decentralized governance (or even an central one) requires a culture of people willing and able to self-govern. When the cultural norm no longer emphasizes such things as individual responsibility/accountability; self-reliance; care for one’s neighbors, community, and society (as in personally working to improve those); or the value of free and open debate; then it becomes a culture incapable of maintaining a decentralized society due to individual indifference and irresponsibility. And therein lies the only solution I see, culture. Centralization is to an extent necessary, but if the values of that society can be preserved then perhaps the system can maintain its flexibility and accountability while reaping the benefits of centralized organization. This culture would also serve as a bulwark against excessive reliance on ever more powerful central power.

    To this end of cultural preservation, I have no effective course of action. I would say to instill it in all children from an early age and have every institution like sports, movies, and universities preach these values as absolutes, but to force that on people would be no better than any other forced indoctrination regime (and just as easily turned to malevolent ends). Besides, a people unwilling to accept such an idea on their own won’t suddenly live by nor believe it because you force them to.

    So, in closing these values must be willingly adopted by a people for their society to survive centralization.

    1. Your assessment on how centralization happens over time was very insightful. However, your recommendations on how to fix the phenomenon weren’t as strong. Not from a lack of thought, but maybe because there aren’t a lot of great options. I personally think accountability for those at the top rungs of the ladder would help mitigate the centralization of power. I also think the people uniting and deciding to focus on similarities, and how they envision a government would help as well.

    2. @ Col Scheller

      How do you actually hold our leaders accountable? It seems that the system is set up to do the opposite.

      Leaders in the military and the government, in general, don’t seem to have any consequences for their actions.

    3. We can hold our government accountable by voting locally for those who will represent us. We have to vote at each and every single local election. That will create change that is visible in our communities. We must not be lazy to getting out to vote. We the silent majority don’t vote enough locally in our communities. Then we must ask those representatives to make sure that our military knows they should be nonpartisan period! Their role is to defend our country and our constitution. Not pick a party like they have. WE the people need to demand military accountability at the highest levels and insure Afghanistan doesn’t happen again. After Vietnam there was accountability, many people were fired and many reports were written on what could have been done. Why have we stopped doing that? Why is it that we have allowed our highest military leaders to go unaccountable for their actions? what changed? what policies were put in place for this to happen? We need to ask for questions and demand answers, even if the answers are ugly, we must face them so that we can institute change. The military is not indispensable. The people who serve our country are not pawns, we don’t get to die for the sake of someone’s career advancement or monetary gains. We must demand more of our leaders if we want to bring this country back from where it is going. My humble opinion.

  10. @Stuart:

    “I personally think accountability for those at the top rungs of the ladder would help mitigate the centralization of power.”

    The Romans had the position of Tribune (“tribunis plebis”) to hold each and every public official accountable. The etymology of the word (“tribus” in Latin, “tribe” in English) tells us everything we need to know. Our IG was modeled after it, but it obviously lacks the same teeth. Of course, there’s another problem with a very powerful Tribune: Human Nature. Always and everywhere Man suffers from the same vices – greed, pride, lust, etc. So you see, technology, the speed of communications, etc. is inconsequential if the same species is in charge. At best it may effect tyranny a bit faster. But those same systems can easily have the tables turned on the tyrants, thus rendering everything but the tyrant himself a moot point.

    “I also think the people uniting and deciding to focus on similarities, and how they envision a government would help as well.”

    Unite under the banner of Christ, certainly. It’s the only way to reunite a lost “tribe”/”confederation”, a tribe too divided by race. However, when a tribe doesn’t speak the same language or doesn’t share the same culture or doesn’t force conformity of an ideology, it’s impossible.

    You will never convince somebody like me to “unite” with an atheist, materialistic, ignorant (in the literal sense of the word) Anglophile or Californian. Not gonna happen. It’s not merely a line in the sand…I carved it into the concrete before it cured.

    I have watched adolescent suicides go through the roof. Why? Because a bunch of cowardly old people on the one hand and liberals on the other have compromised the very fabric of our civilization. And what is civilization? It’s nothing more than the whole being greater than the sum of its parts, where we all come together with a common goal of achieving something greater than any one person.

    The Boomers as a generational COHORT (not each one as an individual, natch!) and the coastal liberals are terrified of death. They don’t believe in any sort of God or they wouldn’t be quivering like little school girls in their Bruno Maglis.

    But the aforementioned “do-gooders” at best and cowards (more likely) cannot and will not admit they were wrong let alone make amends for the deaths and mental illnesses they’ve caused in our progeny. We have kids who are staring at death sentences in 5 years due to myocarditis (as high as 2/3s), but nobody is acknowledging it. Not one of these cretins realizes that NEVER IN HUMAN HISTORY has an entire nation let alone the world shut down to protect the infirmed from the healthy. That’s what sanitariums and nursing homes were for! How godless does an individual or a society have to be to do this?

    There will be NO unity without Justice. And in our current judiciary, there will be no justice because that same judiciary is on board with their fellow government apparatchiks who enforce this evil!

    Now, you might as a good entrepreneur realize that the NYC Metro area has a GDP alone of $1.7 trillion. The nation has a GDP of $22 trillion. You might even say that our sickcare system, part of the financialization of our economy by NYC/Wall Street, has grown from 4% of GDP to 20% of GDP today. (I’m setting aside the fact that there are already laws on the books that should have prevented this – 15 USC Chapter 1 and two SCOTUS decisions – but they were IGNORED.) For sure there would be a steep price if we cut them out of our lives. But what price must our souls, our heritage, our children pay in blood, sweat, and tears if we continue with the insanity?

    Stuart, God bless you but I for one will not unite with evil people. Remember when I said that the Stoics laid out the case for objective good and objective evil? I can forgive them for they know not what they do. But they must face Justice.

    Every. Single. One.

    And the only way a Christian of good conscience can enforce this when the rule of law has disappeared is to refuse to feed, clothe, and shelter the evil people. For you see, it is just as evil for me to tolerate what New York, California, etc. has done to this country, as it is for them to perpetrate it!

    Peace is the answer. But no food, fuel, electronics, or anything else, either.

  11. @Stuart:

    “I think you are obviously well read and have thought about this a great deal. I appreciate the insight. I also agree the swiss do a lot of good things. The way they protect information from being collected on their citizens is a great example. But to your last point, I don’t think we are headed to a National divorce. I understand it’s worth discussing, but I prefer Lincoln’s philosophy of Unity. I think we still have time to bring people together.”

    I thoroughly enjoy shooting the shit with you, brother. At least while I’m on PTO. 🙂 Either my wife or me (forgive my absent-mindedness, I am involved in too much stuff) sent your wife our contact info months ago if you ever needed anything. I think she wanted your wife to feel some inner solace by reading our story, so we sent her the news articles.

    I felt so badly for what you were going through, on all levels. It was like watching my life in an alternate universe about 10 years ago.

    Listen, brother: I look at Lincoln and his mirror image, Davis, in the same way I do FDR. They’re the Boomer cohort of their time (again, Fourth Turning) and were willing to sacrifice everyone else to fulfill their visions of the world. Was Lincoln about unity, really? I wonder what the hundreds of thousands of dead soldiers thought.

    We nearly lost thousands of varieties of apples (biodiversity) because of his scorched earth policy. I’ve been dedicating significant time to find these varieties and reintroduce them to the South. Because of his lack of foresight and our greed, what would happen if a virus swept through the half a dozen varieties we grow now?

    And if it were about the slave trade, then why the heavy hand on the Southern slave states but not on Yankee slaveholders? Why wait until halfway through the War to free them? Could it be because the Irish refused to be his cannon fodder? Why his bigoted commentary in the debates with Stephen Douglas?

    This may seem like a digression, but EVERY American needs to reassess who they are, what they’ve done in life, and what they think they know. Including and especially me and I’m working on it!

    I feel where you’re coming from. But you’re never going to convince a Nebraska corn farmer or an Alabama electrician to unite with a San Francisco Face Diaper mandater or a New York banker.

    Change my mind.

    1. Senor FrogJanuary 2, 2022

      “I feel where you’re coming from. But you’re never going to convince a Nebraska corn farmer or an Alabama electrician to unite with a San Francisco Face Diaper mandater or a New York banker”

      Youd be surprised how quickly people who allegedly hate eachother will forget their differences in the face of a larger issue.

    2. Mike GilbertJanuary 5, 2022

      Lincoln believed that “secession would destroy the world’s only existing democracy, and prove for all time, to future Americans and to the world, that a government of the people cannot survive.” While he was an abolitionist, if he had to choose between ending slavery and keeping the Country united to demonstrate democracy worked he would choose unity of the country. Lincoln evolved during the course of his presidency to where he came to the realization that the nation would not remain united if slavery existed. If you read through his second inaugural address he references “God” and how it was God’s will to end slavery and the war was but a means to do this:

      “The Almighty has His own purposes. “Woe unto the world because of offences! for it must needs be that offences come; but woe to that man by whom the offence cometh!” If we shall suppose that American Slavery is one of those offences which, in the providence of God, must needs come, but which, having continued through His appointed time, He now wills to remove, and that He gives to both North and South, this terrible war, as the woe due to those by whom the offence came, shall we discern therein any departure from those divine attributes which the believers in a Living God always ascribe to Him? Fondly do we hope — fervently do we pray — that this mighty scourge of war may speedily pass away. Yet, if God wills that it continue, until all the wealth piled by the bond-man’s two hundred and fifty years of unrequited toil shall be sunk, and until every drop of blood drawn with the lash, shall be paid by another drawn with the sword, as was said f[our] three thousand years ago, so still it must be said “the judgments of the Lord, are true and righteous altogether”

      Lincoln knew that if the war were lost it would be the end democracy and unity. It wasn’t about political career, party or nation or enriching himself which is what you find today from political elite and senior military leaders. This is a man that was not profiting from his time in office, he lost a son in the middle of his first term, carried the weight of 750k dead Americans on his shoulders which physically destroyed him and put more into the survival of the country then comforting his grieving/depressed wife (ultimately forcibly committed to an asylum following his death). He also took the time to go to the front line, at unbelievable personal risk, to meet with his troops and senior military leaders. While his policies could be debated, his resolve and motives were unquestionable. I believe that his goal was unity for the sake of proving to the world that a government by the people was the model for all to follow.

  12. Mackatea69@gmail.comJanuary 2, 2022

    I don’t know that I’m as far down this road as you are, or as well educated for that matter.

    Still, I’ve studied history for much of my life and I am concerned about how far we’ve fallen in terms of our societal morals. That alone often leads to catastrophic consequences for nations.

    In addition, while social media has in some ways allowed us to come closer together it has also facilitated censorship on a enormous scale. Combine that with a general lack of tolerance for dissenting opinions and we’ve got a large chasm to cross just to get to the point where we can find common ground to build from.

    I’m not yet to the point where I believe our differences are irreconcilable but i think we’re heading down that road. I live in a very rural part of the country and our lives and needs for the most part differ dramatically from those in the large cities you’ve mentioned.

    In fact, if the admittedly slanted views we see in the media are any indication, our general belief systems are incompatible. I don’t believe that to be entirely true but I do suspect there’s some truth in that view.

    I dread the idea of secession and fear the consequences could be devastating but I think it may come to that if we don’t find a way to come together and reverse the trend. In my heart I still believe most Americans want this.

    Those currently in leadership positions, both civilian and military, are not the ones to lead us out of this mess. We need to fight to replace them or force them to abandon their commitment to the Establishment and restore their commitment to the people. They need to remain slightly uncomfortable in their roles as should any of us that are striving for self-improvement.

    I still believe we can return to the UNITED States but that belief is faltering I must admit.

    I’m willing to fight to save our nation. I’m hoping enough others are too and that our differences can yet be peaceably resolved.

    1. Mackatea,

      What a great post. I’m trying to figure out how to process it, LOL.

      I guess starting from the beginning, I personally didn’t realize what an ignorant, arrogant piece of crap I was until I hit rock bottom. For me, it was a “slow at first and then all at once” maturation process. Lots of personal details in there that perhaps one day I’ll share with America when the time is right. And that time will be on God’s watch, not mine. Thus far, He hasn’t made me uncomfortable enough yet to “cough it up”. 🙂

      I gotta go hang some Rockwool in the chicken coop and learn some basic woodworking skills in a few minutes, before winter is upon my hilly driveway once again.

      I’ll leave you with this thought: What is the etymology of the word “culture”? It derives from the Latin cultura, meaning “tending to or guarding of the land; farming/caring for said land; agriculture, cultivating.” In essence, caretaking of something sacred.

      From where does the word “cult” derive? Latin “cultus”, meaning “cultivation; tending; caring; reverence”. Half of this country is desperately trying to hold onto Christianity, a sacred culture/cult that is ingrained in our Founding. The other half reveres its polar opposite culture/cult, that of Atheism. They willingly accept the supremacy of State over God, over Individual Liberty.

      Why? Many reasons, but they all stem from the worst inclinations of Man. Avarice, anger, fear, you name it.

      Individual Liberty CANNOT coexist with Atheism. With the new COVID Cult, with the racial division, etc. God made it crystal clear that we have the free will to choose good or evil, that we would have Due Process (“Am I my Brother’s keeper?”) upon trial, and that we’d have to accept the consequences of those actions.

      The COVID Cult – the Atheists – believe in Force. The sinister part of that half of the country is that they veil themselves in “kindness for Gramps”, or some obscure notion of charity in their warped illogic. But charity does not come at the end of a gun. It extends from free will, from the Individual choosing Good over Evil – and an objective Good at that.

      I am not here to convince anyone of my way of thinking. I believe there are going to be millions who come to the same conclusion later down the road when things get much worse. I just demand that my community be left alone in peace while the world burns.

  13. Senor FrogJanuary 2, 2022

    I don’t think centralization of power is a key characteristic of any type of political or governmental system. I do think that the type of person generally interisted in increasing their own power is invariably drawn to politics. Political systems dont pass laws or draft legislation, people do this, the system is simply the framework for how they do this. SO centralization of power is something I see as more of a consequence of who is involved in a system, rather than the system its self.

    As for a solition from leadership. That depends on the level of leadership within that system we are talking about.

    Senior leadership is not generally present in any orginization to personally vett or influence new members at a scale that matters. What they can do is empower lower levels of leadership to root out bad apples and enforce strict vetting procedures. If there is anyone at the mid or lower levels they don’t trust with that level of responsibility, they need to replace them.

    There is no point in having a squad leader you cant trust to run that squad. The same needs to happen in any system for it to maintain strength and flexibility. The core purpose for being must be adhered to at all times. Individuals whose motivation is personal power need identified and removed.

    Another issue, especially in democratically based political systems is partisanship, where no one person is nessecarily seeking personal power, but their collective focus shifts from the mission of legislating well to simply trying to get more internal power than the “other” side at all costs.

    A Constitutional Amendment strictly limiting how parties operate could be a solution, or even outlawing them entirely, but how to do that in a way that doesnt wind up being counter productive or simply driving their existence underground is a question I don’t know that an answer exists for

  14. @Senor Frog:

    “Youd be surprised how quickly people who allegedly hate eachother will forget their differences in the face of a larger issue.”

    Oftentimes very true. 9/11 = Exhibit A. But this is a Fourth Turning that is driven by the collapse of the world reserve currency. We’re talking debt and civic decay on a once in 300+ years cycle, compounded by 20 straight years of utter Bravo Sierra agitprop that people are just waking up to.

    Furthermore, there isn’t a global conflict we’d win today, even if we wanted to. I realize that that is the primary motivating factor with the upcoming conflict in Ukraine. It won’t work. The waxing we’d take would be measured in weeks, not months or years. We’re busy spending hundreds of trillions on transgender training and F-35 boondoggles while the ChiComs and Russia surpass us in cyberspace and outer space.

    Good luck with that I say. Especially when the world shuns the dollar in 5-10 years.

  15. Senor FrogJanuary 3, 2022

    A more relevant example than 9/11 to our current situation would likely be how quickly Israelis and saudis get along the moment an iranian steps into the picture.

    My post wasnt about anything other than unity, so the other issues are kinda irrelevant to it, however I do agree that unified or not, we are in for an epic shitstorm.

    One we wont get through without unity. But might if we can pull our heads out of our colletive asses and start acting like a country again.

    1. The day I decided to NEVER unify with an Atheist liberal was when they said, in effect, they wanted to MURDER my children with the clot shot so they’d have a safe space. I have friends and family who’ve lost their livelihoods without even so much as a dignified denial for their religious exemptions. Some of them had previously been in seminary for God’s sake!

      No compromises. I’m willing to put it all on the line at this point. I’m not worried about where my soul goes…I’ve done the best I can do to protect my family and my honor. Them, however…well, I’d secure my own supplies if I were them. I wouldn’t feed them if the ChiComs had boots on the ground in Monterey.

      To tolerate that type of wicked evil is to become evil myself.

    2. Senor FrogJanuary 3, 2022

      @publius Atheism has nothing to do with political views. There are a metric fuckton of atheist libertarians and conservatives, you dont see them openly admit such because of attitudes such as yours as well as the political stranglehold certain abrahamic groups have in the conservative political sphere.

      You remind me of a guy i know, who had never served, or so much qs heard a shot fired in anger who always insisted on the observably false trope “there are no atheists in fox holes”

      There are.

      Countries like china and russia will literally destroy us if we dont stop making silly distinctions about who we associate with.

  16. @Senor Frog:

    “Atheism has nothing to do with political views. There are a metric fuckton of atheist libertarians and conservatives, you dont see them openly admit such because of attitudes such as yours as well as the political stranglehold certain abrahamic groups have in the conservative political sphere.”

    With all due respect, I’ve heard it all before. Especially the ad hominems. I wasn’t talking about the “Abrahamic groups”. Read very carefully what I said. And yet, at least those Abrahamic groups, which I am NOT a fan of, have the balls to fight for something other than…than what? What is America’s cause these days?

    “You remind me of a guy i know, who had never served, or so much qs heard a shot fired in anger who always insisted on the observably false trope “there are no atheists in fox holes””

    Same goes here. I’m not going to attack you personally. I don’t know you and you don’t know me. But as for “service”? Remember to thank your local farmer for feeding you while you earned a pension he’ll never get. The BTUs it took to create your equipment? All produced by an offshore rig dude risking his life to build the wealth of the nation.

    It isn’t a chicken or the egg thing here. We don’t need a standing army if we don’t produce anything to defend. Or did you think Americans should thank you for taking money away from their pockets while they live hand to mouth?

    Be careful who you judge. You don’t know where I’ve worked, what I’ve done, what failures I’ve had, what successes I’ve had. I’m not trying to convince anyone of anything except to quit with the weak thinking and be a bit more introspective.

    Good luck and God bless.

    1. Senor frogJanuary 3, 2022

      There was nothing “ad hominem” in my previous post. Simply stating you reming me of a specific individual. Ad hominem would be more along the lines of name calling, questioning your integriry accusing you of being a liar ect. Unless of course im sorely mistaken on the definition of the term, but I doubt it.

      Im aware you didnt bring up those groups. I did, simply to point out why atheists who tend to be more right leaning or conservative/libertarian keep it to their selves among people who share many of the same political positions. I did this to point out a hurdle that needs to be overcome in reaching the degree of national consensus qnd unity nessecary to even have a chance at not getting bulldozed by foreigners.

      As for not needing a standing army…….that is simply false. History is filled with the corpses of nations which produced little of significant value at the time and still got wrecked due to not having a reasonably sized professional fighting force.

      Having a standing army vs a localized militia is a huge advantage, its a big reason why the romans were able to dominate many of their opponents.

      Warfighting is a skillset like any other and those who make it their life will always be more proficient than those who regard it as a supplementary skill.

      Regardless none of this is even remotely close to the original topic.

      What do you honestly expect to achieve by turning down potential allies simply because they dont believe in some of the same religious things individuals who have a political stance you disagree with also disbelieve in?

      In what way is turning away potential support going to increase your survivability or further the political task of getting back to a government that functions properly and adheres to its governing doccuments?

  17. Mike GilbertJanuary 3, 2022

    If you mean by “centralize power”, do they become tyrannical, I would say they can and we are starting to see this now in the United States. Power is centralizing around a political elite class that has moved from public servant, to the few self-serving their own interest. The same people continue to lead in this system, which drives a myopic agenda geared towards maintaining power versus what is best for the common good of the People and the Country. The Declaration of Independence called for patience and that “Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes”. I believe we are moving past transient causes and current policy is driving the Country towards catastrophic failure. As an example, we will have ~2M illegal immigrants entry our Country this year. I believe in legal immigration and the rule of law. We have no idea who or what (drugs, weapons, etc.) is entering our Country right now and neither side is really doing anything about it. The far left is letting it happen and the right is crying foul but not really pushing policy to curtail the issue. Real leaders would step up and hold up every agenda item until this issue was addressed. The mainstream media for the most part is ignoring the issue, which is a massive problem in itself. This is just one of many issues our Country is facing right now. Part of keeping the system flexible and responsive is installing term limits and create laws that eliminate the possibility of public officials enriching themselves through public office. We have to turnover the leadership often and we have to install leaders that are there to truly serve the public.

    1. Mike… I completely agree with this comment about immigration. Funny… I just replied to someone else about how NATO was a dying organization and I think we should do away with it. What if we take the thousands of military members and hundreds of millions in budget devoted to NATO/ European security, and stick them on our own border for our own security. We could solve two problems with one solution. Just sayin…

  18. @Senor Frog:

    “There was nothing “ad hominem” in my previous post. Simply stating you reming me of a specific individual. Ad hominem would be more along the lines of name calling, questioning your integriry accusing you of being a liar ect. Unless of course im sorely mistaken on the definition of the term, but I doubt it.”

    You understand the term, and I stand corrected. You’re right, I never enlisted. I’m thankful I didn’t because I wouldn’t have become what I have. I also would’ve never built the systems that literally every Navy, Army and Marine (I don’t think Air Force) servicemember has used if they enlisted post 9/11, at least up until 2012. For 14 years. And I wouldn’t have completely walked away from that career and lost a shitload of bennies and pay in the process.

    Just like my wife, a disabled vet who did enlist, who has endured more than she ever should have, and who wouldn’t have become who she did otherwise.

    Different roads that ended up in the same place. Stories matter, Frog. Stories matter. It’s who we are as humans.

    “Im aware you didnt bring up those groups. I did, simply to point out why atheists who tend to be more right leaning or conservative/libertarian keep it to their selves among people who share many of the same political positions. I did this to point out a hurdle that needs to be overcome in reaching the degree of national consensus qnd unity nessecary to even have a chance at not getting bulldozed by foreigners.”

    They’re almost assuredly atheists because they haven’t had to dig trenches in their back yards. Yet. Or feed themselves. Like I said, nature teaches something more than how to sustain a pear tree from fire blight. It’s humbling.

    Ownership is reliant upon what you can defend. Americans only briefly (and barely) touched on it in WW2. I’ve been telling people to tribe up since 2008. Some listened, not many.

    My community doesn’t plan on getting bulldozed by the ChiComs. Could we get bulldozed? Well, yeah. I’d say we have an 80% chance at survival. Maybe 75%. I was the one creating the area study, vulnerability assessment, strategic relocations, etc. We’ll likely do OK. Worse than a few, better than most by far. Frankly, I’d be more concerned at Washington though if I were the average American. They know how to squeeze folks until they squeal.

    “As for not needing a standing army…….that is simply false. History is filled with the corpses of nations which produced little of significant value at the time and still got wrecked due to not having a reasonably sized professional fighting force.”

    It’s entirely true. Yes, of course tribes get wrecked if they can’t defend themselves. That’s human instinct. They’re also multi-taskers. A tribal watchman also rotates onto the hunt, or contributes in other ways. It’s a true community.

    I’m talking standing armies. How do you think they eat? Who clothes them? Who manufactures anything and everything they use? Simple example, at Valley Forge they were eating their own boots. They didn’t have the productive capacity of the cobbler or the wealth of a nation to outfit them. Not enough food because poor quality and reduced quantity of crops. Smallpox sucks.

    Haiti isn’t a nation. It’s lines drawn on a map with a bunch of warlords and a populace that produces nothing of value. It doesn’t need a standing army. Economically speaking, nobody gives a shit about it. Ike says it better than I ever could.

    “Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. This world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children. The cost of one modern heavy bomber is this: a modern brick school in more than 30 cities. It is two electric power plants, each serving a town of 60,000 population. It is two fine, fully equipped hospitals. It is some fifty miles of concrete pavement. We pay for a single fighter plane with a half million bushels of wheat. We pay for a single destroyer with new homes that could have housed more than 8,000 people. This is, I repeat, the best way of life to be found on the road the world has been taking. This is not a way of life at all, in any true sense. Under the cloud of threatening war, it is humanity hanging from a cross of iron.”
    – The Chance for Peace (1953)

    “Warfighting is a skillset like any other and those who make it their life will always be more proficient than those who regard it as a supplementary skill.”

    Proficient at warfighting. Not proficient at the skills this country is about to need. I could be wrong, but I’m calling it as I see it. Supply and demand. I have plenty of buddies who were warfighters. They know damn well who’s King. I love every single one of them. But they could not have accomplished even 10% of what I’ve accomplished. They would tell you the same thing. And I don’t do any of it for myself, just to make that clear. Every bit of it is for my children, my family, my God, my friends, my community. I feel blessed.

    “What do you honestly expect to achieve by turning down potential allies simply because they dont believe in some of the same religious things individuals who have a political stance you disagree with also disbelieve in?”

    Because everything you think is immaterial to Christianity is entirely based in it. That patriarchy, unlike Judaism, gave us property rights. Due process and basic morae are all sourced in the Bible. Thou shalt not murder (NOT “kill”) – the morality of self-defense – is foundational. Even Marcus Aurelius in Meditations hedged when he acknowledged the likely existence of one God – my supposition is that it came from his time spent gardening.

    Is this really digression? The Virginian Founders didn’t think so. This is 90% of what they discussed back in the day. I’ve spent the last 13 years consuming everything they wrote, everything Locke and Machiavelli and Bastiat, etc. penned, so I could become more aware of how we fell and how far.

    “In what way is turning away potential support going to increase your survivability or further the political task of getting back to a government that functions properly and adheres to its governing doccuments?”

    With all due respect, do I cross you as an idiot? I’m asking you an honest question. I likely don’t have your warfighting capabilities. I don’t have my wife’s ability at the range, either. But I observe and read and listen before I come to any hard and fast conclusion. I don’t kneejerk or circle-jerk. No time for horseshit where I come from.

    I came to Stuart’s site because he proved his big brass balls when he dropped the mic, IMHO. That’s not easy to do. Been there, done that, got the shitty T-shirt and the pissed off wife. I came here to both learn and to teach. I want your children and mine to have a better world.

    I’m not just throwing bombs to throw bombs. I want you all to really think about your missions, your goals, your orders of battle. You’re not going to go into Washington and change a damn thing. Prepare for the worst, hope for the best. Many of you are VERY likely to get elected. I can tell you exactly how your first week is going to transpire.

    I want you to win. I’m on your side. The only reason I even got off the sidelines in 2016 was because I was under the delusion that Trump had accomplished more than me in his life. Boy was I wrong. He was a grifter who couldn’t hire a qualified dog catcher.

    Politics is jawboning “survival of the fittest”. I can do a better job than anyone in there. Anyone. And it wouldn’t make a damn bit of difference in the grand scheme of things unless I was Caesar. That’s reality, there’s nothing I can do to change that, so why worry about it?

    If you want to discuss your specific ideas RE: Unity, we can do that. I can give you my advice on what would work and what wouldn’t. You can ignore it or listen to it. I could be wrong, but I’m probably right. One thing I CAN promise you is that I care about every damn one of you. If you want to WIN, then you’ve gotta study Maslow’s Hierarchy of Needs and use that exactly like the ChiComs know how to. That’s why I support a peaceful strike. Hit ’em where it hurts.

    God bless you!

  19. Senor frogJanuary 3, 2022

    “They’re almost assuredly atheists because they haven’t had to dig trenches in their back yards. Yet. Or feed themselves. Like I said, nature teaches something more than how to sustain a pear tree from fire blight. It’s humbling.”

    Trenches in their backyard? How about fighting holes in Afghanistan, plenty have. Feed themselves? Plenty of them hunt most of their food.

    This Idea you have that a lack of religious belief is somehow grounded in not working or taking risks is simply wrong.

    As for the stuff where your basic point seems to be that the military would somehow be useless without civilliqns making all their stuff and food, I would point you toward the countless historical raids where the participants equiped and fed themselves. The Huns are of particular note.

    “With all due respect, do I cross you as an idiot? I’m asking you an honest question. I likely don’t have your warfighting capabilities. I don’t have my wife’s ability at the range, either. But I observe and read and listen before I come to any hard and fast conclusion. I don’t kneejerk or circle-jerk. No time for horseshit where I come from.”

    The whole reason I replied Initially was because you seemed to knee jerk and automatically reject an entire class of people because of an irrelevant shared characteristic. So i tried to show what you seemed to think was impossible was by pointing out grouos with more differences who managed to get over them for a common goal.

    Back to the unity line, would you refust to go to a protest you agreed with the premise of if you found out one of the organizers was atheist?

  20. @Senor Frog:

    “Trenches in their backyard? How about fighting holes in Afghanistan, plenty have. Feed themselves? Plenty of them hunt most of their food.”

    Not the same and if you don’t know that, then you’ll end up a future casualty where this country is headed. I can’t make you believe that. Unfortunately for me though, I also can’t unsee what I’ve seen firsthand. Fighting in a sandbox thousands of miles away from where ever you live does not and will not prepare you for having to fight your countrymen, defend your 5 year old daughter, or pull a Red Dawn. You may be a better shot. It will NOT prepare you for the horrors of inter-street fighting in Bosnia. Ask me how I know.

    And they can hunt to their heart’s content. Let’s see how that works out once the deer are depopulated by everyone else thinking the same thing, which will happen in maybe 2 seasons. Maybe. They also have to defend it. They don’t own it if they can’t defend it.

    “As for the stuff where your basic point seems to be that the military would somehow be useless without civilliqns making all their stuff and food, I would point you toward the countless historical raids where the participants equiped and fed themselves. The Huns are of particular note.”

    Great tribe, not as good as the Mongols but pretty badass. The Mongols captured lightning in a bottle. Both were nomadic.

    Tribal warfare vs. a standing army: You’re making my point. They were multi-tasker, tribal units with a crude division of labor. Basic laws of economics here. You will have no specialized equipment. Maybe raspberry pis with commercial drones, assuming you can find them on the black market. You will have no exotic foods. You won’t have the plastic to wrap MREs in. Yes, you may be able to import some of your weaponry. You may be able to source crude explosives from a resourceful redneck. You will NOT get paid. You will NOT have a pension. You may not even have standard issue uniforms.

    Are you willing to do all of the above pro bono, or on a divvy of the loot from a raid?

    If no, you are taken care of by the producers of the nation. Thank your local farmer, artisan, mechanic for everything they do for you. Expect no thanks in return. It is a very rewarding way to go through life.

    BTW: The Founders believed in citizen-soldiers. We call ourselves “warfighters” now. Do you know why? Detachment from home and hearth; association with total, constant war.

    “The whole reason I replied Initially was because you seemed to knee jerk and automatically reject an entire class of people because of an irrelevant shared characteristic. So i tried to show what you seemed to think was impossible was by pointing out grouos with more differences who managed to get over them for a common goal.”

    I have had family members fired for refusing the clot shot. One is a 32 year retired O-6 with a stellar performance both inside and outside the public sector. Another has a medical condition. I have a wife with cancer right now whose own onc tried to force her to take the jab. I had to run interference on that one. And don’t get me started on my kids.

    This entire fraud is ENTIRELY due to a populace scared of its own shadows. No society who believes in God would hide under their desks like a bunch of school girls of the flu. No government allegedly comprised of “Judeo-Christian men and women” – whatever the fuck that means anyways – would EVER do something so demonic.

    In short, it ain’t knee jerk. You all wanna meet these Clown Car Brigades in the “center”? Go for it man. I’m certainly not gonna stop you. I personally will not entertain it. The fruits of atheism are all around us. Just look at what a bunch of skirts we’ve become in this country. Nothing to die for, every reason to fear death.

    “Back to the unity line, would you refust to go to a protest you agreed with the premise of if you found out one of the organizers was atheist?”

    13 years ago I started blogging about what we needed to do to fix the mess. You’ve likely read some of my articles. Thirteen. Fucking. Years. And you want me to unify under someone or someones who I was 13 years ahead of? Really? With all I’ve accomplished without anyone chipping in?

    C’mon man. I lead. I don’t follow. I unite with like minds. I’m not interested in the modern-day conservative’s view of “diversity and inclusion”. That’s all this “unity” sounds like it is to me. There will come a point where shit will get so bad that I will know when it’s time to help ALL of my brothers and sisters in Christ, black, brown, white, or otherwise. But it will be on God’s watch. Not any man’s.

    No, I will not attend another rally, protest, or anything. Atheists present or not. I have a farm to run, children to raise, a wife to nurture back to health, a career to wind down, a chicken coop to insulate, neighbors who are dying and need palliative assistance.

    I am with you all in peace and love, brother.

    1. Senor frogJanuary 4, 2022

      Whats your blog? Id love to read your articles.

      When the huns invaded, they abandoned their tribal model of warfare in favor of a standing army model, and while the founders loved the idea of citizen soldiers, it was primarily intended as a check on government power, lets not forget they constitutionally enshrined an army and navy.

      I also find your inclination toward positive tribalism interisting, how do you reconcile your christian faith with it?

      Christianity had prehaps the biggest role in moving the west away from tribal social structures.

  21. @Senor Frog:

    “Whats your blog? Id love to read your articles.”

    Never had my own blog nor participated in (mainstream) social media. You can read some of my articles over the last few years on The Burning Platform still. Pretty sure Jim Quinn still has them out there, I don’t think he’s deleted anything since the site migration. That guy is a godsend. Fierce proponent of free speech, so much so that some of the comments section for me personally leaves a bad taste in my mouth. But Jim Quinn and Karl Denninger (Market-Ticker) are today’s Thomas Paines IMHO.

    I still comment when I have the time on Market Ticker. Not much time these days.

    I don’t need to tell you what my nom de plumes are on either site. A linguist will be able to identify it within 15 minutes. Let me see if a couple of other sites still have my old ass articles.

    “When the huns invaded, they abandoned their tribal model of warfare in favor of a standing army model, and while the founders loved the idea of citizen soldiers, it was primarily intended as a check on government power, lets not forget they constitutionally enshrined an army and navy.”

    I’m clearly doing a poor job of communicating Economics 101 here. I think the best way to grok what I’m saying is what this country is about to go through, when enough of the producers go on strike. Or die from “unexpected medical conditions”, like the 40% increase in deaths across the board showing up in the life insurance industry among 18-60 year olds. 10% is a 3 Sigma, once in 200 year event BTW.

    We shall see who needs whom. Somebody has to make the cheese.

    Go read Article I Section 8 very closely to understand what the Founders’ intent with respect to an army was. Not a navy. An army. Go read George Mason and George Washington. There’s a radical difference between regulars and “standing army”.

    I’ll tell you this: If I hadn’t been paying for other people’s boondoggles in faraway lands, maybe we would’ve had a cure for breast cancer. Maybe my daughter could’ve been spared a lifetime of struggle. This isn’t debatable. For every soldier that’s fed, there’re 10 single mothers out there who’s wondering if there will be enough fucked up, dented cans to buy at half price in the BOGO aisle. And it’s not just direct taxation, it’s indirect taxation thru inflation.

    Notice anything different at the grocery store recently? The chickens ALWAYS come home to roost. It’s just a matter of time. Know who I feel especially bad for? That poor kid who’s pregnant and whose young husband died in Kabul. That’s enraging because it was entirely preventable. And yet other than Stuart Scheller dropping the mic, or folks like Marc Moran or me going on strike, or Karl Denninger and Jim Quinn writing for years and years, WTF has anyone else done? Once it was off the news reel, they jump back to their regularly scheduled “gotta drive my kids to soccer camp”.

    “I also find your inclination toward positive tribalism interisting, how do you reconcile your christian faith with it?”

    My inclination toward tribalism if that’s what you’d call it is based on necessity. By observing my surroundings and making the best decision with the information I have available. I don’t like it because it’s actually returning to the Old Testament, which IMHO is a step backward. But Charles Martel certainly understood the necessity of dropping the hammer (pardon the pun). We’d all be carrying around prayer rugs today if it weren’t for the Merovingians. The notion of a just war wasn’t lost on St. Thomas Aquinas, either. How many “Christians” today know who they are?

    What people think of Christianity today, and what it REALLY is, are wildly disparate. A true Christian wouldn’t have remained addicted to Dancing with the Stars and the iPhone 56. They’d have gone on strike a long time ago like Dr. King did. It’s the famous “Are you religious, materialist, or Gnostic” philosophical question. People ultimately boil down to one of those three, and Americans chose the second.

    I’m not worthy of holding King’s jockstrap. But he did it my way (peacefully), and he won. So there’s that.

    “Christianity had prehaps the biggest role in moving the west away from tribal social structures.”

    In one sense. Christ had His tribe of Apostles and commanded us to follow Him. We as a nation stopped doing that, hence what we are living in today. When Man thinks he’s master of the universe, or is nihilist, he loses meaning. Go read Sam Adams’ speech on Independence about the popery of politics.

    The Catholic Church became corrupted and no longer represents Christianity. Social structures? They supported Lyndon Johnson’s war on the family, just in recent times, which is the smallest and arguably the most important tribe. The patriarchy, however, was a good thing in many senses. Even the Reformative Protestants in the West have lost their way. Perhaps the only Christian denomination that maintained some respect was the Orthodoxy.

    If Russia continues on its current trajectory, I predict a lot of folks abandoning this festering corpse and moving there just to get the hell away from the Marxists. Russia ain’t going back to Communism.

    Westerners tend to look at things linearly. This happened due to this reason. Anyone who’s studied physics and advanced mathematics can tell you that that isn’t true. Everything is connected, everything is multivariate. The Chinese will win because they are patient and they understand cycles.

    My $.02, as usual I could always be wrong.

    Peace and love.

    1. Senor FrogJanuary 4, 2022

      “I’ll tell you this: If I hadn’t been paying for other people’s boondoggles in faraway lands, maybe we would’ve had a cure for breast cancer. Maybe my daughter could’ve been spared a lifetime of struggle. This isn’t debatable. For every soldier that’s fed, there’re 10 single mothers out there who’s wondering if there will be enough fucked up, dented cans to buy at half price in the BOGO aisle. And it’s not just direct taxation, it’s indirect taxation thru inflation”

      You do realize that defense spending isnt even 1/3 of the federal budget? You want to see where all our money is wasted, look at how much is spent on stuff like welfare, medicare, social security and hud. Then look at how much the people on those programs actually recieve.

  22. McKenzie MattinglyJanuary 4, 2022

    Too many great comments to start pointing them all out. Mine is much simpler. We as humans are imperfect beings & prone to err. When we steer away from God or whatever you call your Higher Power, which shouldn’t be another human, our moral compass gets jacked. Fear, greed, hate, intolerance ..the manifestations of lives run amuck on self & ego crowd out the good. People, in my experience, aren’t motivated to change until something effects them personally…they have “skin in the game”. I have witnessed this at a local level where there is blatant corruption yet the same clowns keep getting voted back in because it’s a popularity contest or they have the right name. I have heard on more than one occasion a person who told me they only voted for a certain candidate because said candidate was the only one who came & physically knocked on their door to ask for their vote. No vote given to the most experienced candidate, or the most qualified, or the one with the best ideas, or the one with refreshing energy & enthusiasm. Nope, vote given based upon who knocked on their door. They don’t have “skin in the game” so no desire for change. I’m fearful for the path we are on. I pray for our country. A Divine intervention is welcomed by this voter.

    1. Dale GilbreathJanuary 4, 2022

      I like what you had to say. We need to make our leaders uncomfortable because, as you pointed out, people don’t change if they don’t have to. Not changing means not growing and developing.

      It’s on us to hold them accountable, make them uncomfortable and help drive the change we need.

  23. @Senor Frog:

    “You do realize that defense spending isnt even 1/3 of the federal budget? You want to see where all our money is wasted, look at how much is spent on stuff like welfare, medicare, social security and hud. Then look at how much the people on those programs actually recieve.”

    Agreed 100%, assuming you’re only talking “on-budget”! But I’m not on HuffPo. Otherwise I’d be pointing that out and much more. I want people to think. If I were to go onto HuffPo and talk about gutting war spending (it ain’t defense, it’s the War Department), it’d be a complete waste of time. And there’s little reason to talk about welfare largesse here.

    None of this is sustainable. Who knows exactly when and how, but there isn’t a snowball’s chance in Hades that any of these unfunded liabilities or the debt will ever be repaid. The CCP knows it and they’re brilliant in how they’re likely gonna handle it.

    1. Evergrande-style defaults on Western-held bonds.
    2. Oops, the 315th strain of COVID, gotta shut down Ningbo and destroy more Western supply chains.
    3. We wanna help you, Africa, build out rail and ports. Oh, I’m sure we have several hundred billion in Treasuries to float for the raw and/or finished mats.

    On the other hand, I’m very curious to see what would happen if we defaulted on Chinese-held Treasuries. Could get spicy.

  24. Alan HoyleJanuary 5, 2022

    Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely.
    I takes a truly totally surrendered to the King Yahshua (Jesus) to fight and overcome this drift to evil. Men, real men at even the lowest level in a position would stand to protect those under them is just as a corporal or Sargent should & would to those above him in using the chain of command to protect those under them. The problem is that most people are number one and is who they are most concerned about. This is not a true leader and is not a leader as Scripture relates.

    It is my understanding with the insight that I have is the best public servant position that can and should do this to protect people is the county Sheriff. With this executive position he could and should be dealing with our domestic treasonous enemies empowering the veterans to be his force behind him.
    Gunny

  25. Equating January 6th to Pearl Harbor and Sep. 11 is a shame. This Administration is politcizing that protest to change the way we vote (no I.D. required) ..Nobody who is this desperate to take over our Democracy on a one party basis should be allowed to do this. Hopefully there is one Senate Democrat that will vote against changing the fillabuster rules.

  26. “Centralizing Power” I see power as the issue. Our government should serve we the people.

    Leadership is the other issue. Most people in service professions ie police, first responders, nurses, teachers do it because they love it. These professions make a decent wage albeit not what they deserve for what they do. Government that serves should be the same. Decrease the pay and the perks.

    We are desperately in need of true leaders that lead by example. Republicans in Congress talk alot, but they don’t do anything. President Trump (love him or hate him) was a good leader. He kept his promises and tried to simplify the rules in government. He served we the people. If covid derangement syndrome taught us anything, it taught us there are a lot of sheep that need to be led.

    I agree our government needs to simplify to align with our Constitution. If the Constitution didn’t grant the power to the federal government laws should be ended, departments should be dissolved, and people should be fired.

    Each new Congress sets its own house rules. These rules should include respect for each other regardless of party, and consequences for lack of respect. It should also include balanced budget, bills that are no more than 100 pages on one subject, and bills that do not follow the Constitution will not be brought to the floor. In my experience, if you lay out expectations, most people will try to reach them. We don’t tolerate bullies in school, and they shouldn’t be tolerated in Congress.

    I disagree that this is not like the military. I see an enemy that needs to be defeated. In my opinion that requires a strategic plan that should be mapped out now. The dems don’t play fair so we need to outsmart them. In the end, it goes back to we need leadership.

    Once we readjust Congress, we give the people something to unite around. People have “skin in the game” now. Inflation, covid mandates, education, and safety affect us all. There is a reason many people are flocking to Florida. Florida has good leadership and policies we can get behind.

    1. “Leadership is the other issue. Most people in service professions ie police, first responders, nurses, teachers do it because they love it. These professions make a decent wage albeit not what they deserve for what they do.”

      Not sure I agree with this, i.e. use of the term “most”. Yes, I could see most nurses doing what they do because they love it. Same with first responders. But generally speaking, they don’t have the same benefits packages and pensions like the police, teachers, etc. do. Again, generally speaking.

      If one is in a service profession to truly serve, I personally have a problem with someone receiving better benefits than the folks paying for them. But let’s put aside our personal opinions and focus on facts, which are immutable.

      We have a problem in this country, one of extremes.

      On the side of the left, they want teachers to be paid more and they want to keep the pensions. But they hate the police.

      On the side of the right, they want the police to be paid more and they want to keep the pensions. But they want to defang the teachers and their unions.

      A more pragmatic approach would be to acknowledge the value of service professions across the board, while simultaneously making everyone aware that, in economic terms, we can’t afford them at current run rates. Especially if it’s truly a service profession, that is, an economically consumptive endeavor.

      The doers cannot continue to pay for this. We’re broke. Until America accepts the fact that the only reason we even have these $$$ benefits is due to the exorbitant privilege of the world reserve currency, we’ll continue to focus on the symptoms instead of the disease.

      The problem isn’t the teachers or the police. They’re humans making human decisions in their human self-interest. We all do, it’s how we’re wired. Adam Smith discussed this in detail in Wealth of Nations a la self-interest and the Invisible Hand.

      The problem is that nobody is willing to face the music and sacrifice anything until they’re hungry. That’s what is coming, IMHO. And unfortunately, that usually ends French instead of American RE: Revolution.

      Just my thoughts.

  27. Douglas EckendorfJanuary 7, 2022

    I would like to point out something here.

    1. Military Spending (an enumerated power in the constitution of the federal government) = 3.7 % GDP and 17.5% Fed Budget

    2. The OECD estimates that social welfare spending in the US amounts to roughly 19% of US GDP, or about $3.8 trillion. Most of that spending goes towards entitlement programs such as Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, Food Stamps, etc… which now consume 61% of total federal spending. (none of this is an enumerated power in constitution)

    3. The administrative law agencies in the Federal Government such as EPA, DOT, DOJ, DOE, FDA, CDC, Federal Reserve, BATF, etc (none of them are an enumerated power) comprised of non-elected officials who have the power / authority to promulgate regulations which have the same force as statutory law. By far the most unaccountable arm the federal Government ex: Dr Tony Fauci is a good example… Who have the most interface with the individual citizen in their daily lives… Those agencies make up the difference in federal $ consumption…

    The third group is what the framers warned us about most and they specifically stated that the congressional branch of the government cannot delegate their power to legislate.

    For that reason the 10th Amendment in the Bill of Rights was created so the states would be able to regulate themselves and be the closest government thus having the most accountability to the people / citizens that they governed.. They also had the wisdom and the vision to see that the confederation of states would be a legislative laborotory if you will and successes in one state could be duplicated in another and failures of one could be example to others…… best example today would be Texas vs California…..The people were also free to vote with their feet… Opposite of that is what the Federal Government is currently doing centralizing power in DC and where do you go when that happens???

    This was also the real purpose of the commerce clause so the states would not be able to conduct an economic conflict with one another such as tariffs and border checkpoints they would have to cooperate and compete…Free Market Capitalism at it’s finest.

    The nation is diverse in culture as it is in geography.. Many of the federal agencies are merely bloated bureaucracies that collect federal taxes and redistribute them while at the same time consume a slice of the tax dollars that move through them to pay for their bloated salaries, retirement, health benefits… For that reason every tax dollar that is collected only a portion of that dollar goes to a service the agency provides. This is why the richest counties in the USA are those that surround the District of Columbia… Many of the federal agencies are duplicates of the state level agencies. The difference is the state agencies are far more accountable and while being imperfect are better poised to be responsive to those people that they govern.. Once again Texas vs California

    Return to text of the Constitution and the Bill of Rights…

  28. “1. Military Spending (an enumerated power in the constitution of the federal government) = 3.7 % GDP and 17.5% Fed Budget”

    On-budget. It’s way worse than that. Trillions don’t just vanish into thin air from the Pentagon’s balance sheet. This has been an ongoing theme since GWOT. Tens of trillions.

    And define what, exactly, Article I Section 8 enumerates.

    “2. The OECD estimates that social welfare spending in the US amounts to roughly 19% of US GDP, or about $3.8 trillion. Most of that spending goes towards entitlement programs such as Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, Food Stamps, etc… which now consume 61% of total federal spending. (none of this is an enumerated power in constitution)”

    At risk of repeating myself, it’s worse than that. Social Security is a Ponzi Scheme. Nobody has paid into it more than they take out since its inception. In effect, it’s us paying for our parents. Medicare was scheduled to be broke by 2024 as Karl Denninger has outlined in the past. It’s probably been pulled forward due to the gross spending and complete economic tyranny over the last couple of years. Hundreds of trillions in unfunded liabilities that any sane GAAP accountant knows should be an on balance sheet liability.

    “3. The administrative law agencies in the Federal Government such as EPA, DOT, DOJ, DOE, FDA, CDC, Federal Reserve, BATF, etc (none of them are an enumerated power) comprised of non-elected officials who have the power / authority to promulgate regulations which have the same force as statutory law. By far the most unaccountable arm the federal Government ex: Dr Tony Fauci is a good example… Who have the most interface with the individual citizen in their daily lives… Those agencies make up the difference in federal $ consumption…”

    Indeed.

    “The third group is what the framers warned us about most and they specifically stated that the congressional branch of the government cannot delegate their power to legislate.”

    The bulk of the Framers were most concerned with standing armies and an all-powerful executive. Jefferson even said that they had no idea that the Judiciary would become so loony. As he said, men are not meant to be trusted for life.

    “For that reason the 10th Amendment in the Bill of Rights was created so the states would be able to regulate themselves and be the closest government thus having the most accountability to the people / citizens that they governed.. They also had the wisdom and the vision to see that the confederation of states would be a legislative laborotory if you will and successes in one state could be duplicated in another and failures of one could be example to others…… best example today would be Texas vs California…..The people were also free to vote with their feet… Opposite of that is what the Federal Government is currently doing centralizing power in DC and where do you go when that happens???”

    According to both sides of the aisle, this issue was “settled” with the War Between the States. Of course, perhaps we should force every single Congress Critter to stay married for life. They need to feel the pain personally in order to understand that in no way was the Constitution meant to be a Hotel California. Yet you never hear them bringing up the Anglophile Hartford Convention during the War of 1812!

    “This was also the real purpose of the commerce clause so the states would not be able to conduct an economic conflict with one another such as tariffs and border checkpoints they would have to cooperate and compete…Free Market Capitalism at it’s finest”

    Indeed.

    “The nation is diverse in culture as it is in geography.. Many of the federal agencies are merely bloated bureaucracies that collect federal taxes and redistribute them while at the same time consume a slice of the tax dollars that move through them to pay for their bloated salaries, retirement, health benefits… For that reason every tax dollar that is collected only a portion of that dollar goes to a service the agency provides. This is why the richest counties in the USA are those that surround the District of Columbia… Many of the federal agencies are duplicates of the state level agencies. The difference is the state agencies are far more accountable and while being imperfect are better poised to be responsive to those people that they govern.. Once again Texas vs California”

    DC used to be a sleepy Southern town. I watched the government double in size up to 2008, since the onset of GWOT. I warned people…almost got into a bar brawl in Clarendon as they were broadcasting Gulf 2 on TV.

    “Return to text of the Constitution and the Bill of Rights…”

    Not gonna happen and I’ve literally bet the farm on it. It’s wishful thinking as much as I’d like to believe otherwise. In reality, Jefferson was right. We needed to tweak the Articles of Confederation, not toss them overboard. Too late.

  29. I am a lowly peon, an old woman, and I applaud all of you for your comments. I am working with the Convention of States right now. We need 17 more states to call a constitutional convention. We want term limits and a balance budget. We want states rights instead of W*shington harnesses. Many of the comments about how soft we have gotten and how much material assets have fogged the reality that freedom must be demanded, fought for and revered. May God help us to see how much we have already lost. I listen to Dan Bongino who is currently fighting Cumulus network for their firing of un-vaccinated staff. He and several others are working on an alternative internet market. Consider posting on Rumble* instead of popular leftest trash sites like fac*book, twit*ter,screw tube,tick toc*, etc. Keep the faith we are on the right side of this. Grandma Pat

  30. “To your suggestion that producers stop producing, truckers stop trucking and plumbers stop plumbing…may I respectfully suggest that all you will accomplish is to give government the license to nationalize any and all elements of our infrastructure as they deem necessary to keep the food (and crap) flowing. And the recalcitrant producers, truckers and plumbers will suffer the opprobrium of those being fed by their “saviors” in the government. You can’t hurt the government without hurting the people, and the people are too comfortable to want to play Gandhi.”

    Eh, pretty sure you should go read 19th and early 20th American history again…he’s got a point about a strike, Jose. Farmers are notoriously rebellious and both Lincoln and FDR learned it the hard way. Washington could nationalize all they want…nothing would be left to nationalize. A good chainsaw, combine and a few bags of salt would “fix” an orchard or a farm in 60 minutes. Hell, French farmers merely get pissed off about milk prices and dump loads of cow shit in Parisian politicians’ windows. China would just pile on considering they also decide whether we get goods on store shelves.

    It’s likely the only solution that would work. But it terrifies even the folks on here who want “change”. They don’t want THAT much “change”. You’re right about folks not doing anything while comfortable.

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